“The Indians Roundtable”
will be a regular weekly Sunday feature throughout the baseball season.
One question. Several different answers from TheClevelandFan.com Indians panel.
News came out this past week that
the Indians were close to agreeing on an extension with General Manager
Mark Shapiro, and that a deal would be officially announced anytime
between now and sometime in Spring Training.
While the specifics of the rumored
deal are unknown at this time, it looks like Shapiro is now locked in
with the Tribe for several more years. The question is, is this
a good or bad thing for the organization?
We polled the Indians writers
of The Cleveland Fan for their take on the news. Some of the replies were
similar, but each offered up some fresh takes – and some of the replies
may surprise you:
Tony Lastoria: From this corner, keeping Shapiro
on board for several more years is a good thing. The organization
probably would have survived had he left, especially since Assistant
GM Chris Antonetti is virtually a Shapiro clone. Antonetti likely
would have been Shapiro’s successor in 2008 had he left, but going
from Shapiro to Antonetti would have been a huge drop in experience
at the GM position. By keeping Shapiro on board, it will help
maintain continuity with Shapiro’s philosophy that has been adopted
organization-wise, and also provide more time for Shapiro's vision (plan)
to come better into focus.
Sure, Shapiro has made some mistakes
- notably the Roberto Alomar trade and the Brandon Phillips Debacle - but he has also shown an ability to
learn from those mistakes and not repeat them. Shapiro is also
very conservative in the roster moves he makes when it comes to trades
and free agents - although ownership may be a big reason for that –
and he also tends to be a little over-protective of
his prospects.
And, Shapiro’s biggest problem might be his extreme loyalty to manager
Eric Wedge.
That said, Shapiro did a good
job cleaning house and starting over to where this organization's farm
system is completely rebuilt and arguably the deepest in baseball and
should consistently pump out talent every year. In addition to
that, he has been able to establish a solid core of players at the major
league level to make a championship run with. If Shapiro continues
to be open to new ideas and learning from mistakes, and maybe takes
the shackles off and explores more prospects for major-league talent
trades, he’ll moved to the penthouse suite with other tops GMs like
Terry Ryan and John Schuerholtz. Some may disagree, but the Indians
window of opportunity has just swung open and isn't in danger of closing
anytime soon. A lot of this credit goes to Shapiro.
Steve Buffum: I think this is a good move for
the organization, as unlike the Browns' supposed "continuity is
good" kick, the Indians actually have some track record of success.
It has been pointed out many times that the
team has not made the playoffs during Shapiro's watch. It is indisputable
that Shapiro has made moves that were either bad risks (Aaron Boone)
or simply bad ideas (Ramon Vazquez). But overall the direction of the
team has been good, and even if Shapiro isn't directly responsible for
every success (I doubt he personally recommended every draft choice),
he helped assemble and oversee the management team that has done a good
job.
The other factor here is that
I think Shapiro is a better GM in 2007 than he was in 2003. This comes
from experience as well as knowledge and hard work. It's easy to forget
that Shapiro is only 39: the alternative to extending Shapiro is hiring
someone else. Short of drawing Terry Ryan or Brian Cashman away from
their teams, is there anyone you'd feel comfortable handing the reins
to mid-stream? Maybe Antonetti, but he'd be Shapiro 2003. Maybe someone
from another organization, but again, if you like the direction, isn't
it better to have someone who shared in the steering, who already knows
what the strengths and weaknesses are?
There is one dark cloud in all
of this, though: Eric Wedge. Mark Shapiro is attached at the hip to
Wedge: unless Wedge does something truly egregious like leave Sabathia
in for a 16-inning complete game, drive drunk into the Terminal Tower,
or grow his moustache back, he will manage the Cleveland Indians. I
may have been too subtle and coy about this in the past, but I will
spell it out: I do not think
Eric Wedge is a good manager and want him replaced.
This becomes pretty unlikely,
so obviously, that's a pretty dark cloud.
Overall, I am for the extension.
Play ball!
Rich Swerbinsky: It's good news to me. Listen,
there's a lot to nitpick Shapiro about. The Robby trade, Lawton,
Gutierrez, letting Howry go, trading Brandon Phillips, his ego, the Wedge Love Affair and
no playoffs in his tenure as GM immediately come to mind.
Shapiro has really created his own style of "Moneyball" in my view. A system reliant on one year contracts to reclamation projects and injury risks, and heavy on paying two guys 2-3 million a year apiece to platoon at a spot instead of backing up the Brinks Truck for one high priced player. This season will be the best indicator yet of Shapiro's ability as a GM.
In the end though, who the hell
else are we going to bring in here that's going to be better than Mark?
He's Ivy League educated, been around the game his whole life, well
respected around the league, and has been in this organization forever.
He's been hamstrung financially in past seasons, and given a legitimate
budget this winter, orchestrated an off-season that I was pretty happy
with.
Cris Sykes: Mark Shapiro is the epitome of
average. Most of his moves are reactionary, based on poor decisions
he made in the past. His unwillingness to go the extra mile on
a BJ Ryan and Bob Howry one year, led to the need for spending a majority
of his free agent budget on the bullpen the next year.
Shapiro has shown zero ability
to go out and convince quality free agents that Cleveland is a place
where they can come and win a championship. All I can remember
is an interview where Mark said all he felt he needed to do was allow
free agents the chance to sit down with this staff, see what they are
all about and players would jump at the chance to come here. Yet, we
have finished second an unbelievable number of times.
My biggest issue with Shapiro
is his steadfast support for his buddy Eric Wedge. This duo has
had two months of great baseball in the time they have been the leaders
of this team. The worst part was, with an opportunity to make
a move at the trade deadline that year; Shapiro took a pass, leaving
the Indians a game short of the play-offs. I think the better
plan would have been to wait to see how this year's free agents performed,
and if the Indians win the 90+ games it takes to compete, talk about
a new deal. If he wants to leave after a successful year, I believe any GM could come
in here and perform at this level.
Erik Cassano: I think Mark Shapiro's extension
is great news. Shapiro is one of the best GMs in the game, and people
with far more inside knowledge than myself share that opinion. You can
point to the Roberto Alomar trade and the bullpen disasters of '04 and
'06 as the black marks on Shapiro's resume, but he also managed to piece
together the best bullpen in baseball in 2005.
It's easy to pick at what Shapiro
has done wrong, but don't forget the odds he was facing upon taking
this job. With a far-reduced payroll, he had to rebuild this team in
the span of five years. Last season notwithstanding, he was able to
do that. This team was playoff-caliber again by 2004 and 2005.
He doesn't have a playoff appearance on his resume yet, but for three
years, he has had this team consistently only a few pieces away from
the playoffs, and possibly title contention.
Consider the rebuilding alternative:
The Tigers and Royals. Detroit had to wait 20 years to become competitive
again, and Kansas City is still waiting. What Shapiro did with the resources
he had was impressive, maybe even unprecedented. Results are what
matters, and if you're talking October, then yes, Shapiro still has
something to prove. But the mere fact that he compressed a decade or
more of rebuilding down to less than five years is a testament to his
talent and skill. I'm happy he is staying.
Todd Dery: This is great news. There is nobody
better equipped in dealing with the market constraints and the lack
of a big money owner than Mark Shapiro. After a series of key
blunders in his first year (The Robby Alomar trade essentially netting
nothing; the Lawton and Guttierez contracts), he has taken those experiences
and mastered the art of stocking young talent. Trading Bartolo
Colon for Grady Sizemore, Cliff Lee, and Brandon Phillips is one of
the great fleeces of all-time, but when it went down, everyone thought
Shapiro was nuts.
Nobody is perfect and GM's make
mistakes, but what separates Shapiro from many of his peers is his willingness
to admit those mistakes and learn from them. In this market, Shapiro
is forced to use the "throw as many guys up against the wall and
hope they stick" approach with scrap heap veterans. While nobody
is crazy about that method, it has unearthed guys like Bob Howry, Casey
Blake, and Rafael Betancourt. Terry Ryan perfected this craft in Minnesota
while building a young, talented pitching staff. Sounds a lot like the
Indians model to me.
Jarad Regano: Shapiro getting an extension has
to be viewed as good news. While the torrid love affair with Wedge
gets a little old, any replacement the Indians could have afforded would
have come with much less experience. It also would have probably
come from within.
It is somewhat unsettling giving
an extension to a guy who has not capitalized on what is now year #6
of a rebuild, but the choice had to be made now. In a perfect
world, the Dolan’s could have waited to see how 07 would have unfolded.
However, if the Indians are in the hunt at that time, Shapiro would
have been a hot commodity around the league. This was a good time
for the Dolan’s to bite the bullet and give up a little more organizational
control.
Jeff Rickel: While suspicious that Shapiro is responsible
for holding the payroll back more than most Tribe fans think, this extension
is great news for the Indians and the org's fans. Shapiro has
consistently shown the ability to develop talent internally while attempting
creative approaches to free agency to compensate for Cleveland's smaller
market size.
I believe Mark has been a better steward of the farm system than John Hart ever was and that's important if the Tribe is to succeed now and in the future when you consider escalating salaries in MLB. It's hard to think that anyone could do much better in the Cleveland market unless they were able to go crazy on payroll every year - and even that is no guarantee for success. Mark Shapiro gives the Indians the best chance to compete in the modern MLB. If not for Shapiro then we might be back well into Colavito Curse mode.